Received: from lists.xmission.com (lists.xmission.com [198.60.22.7]) by mail.san.rr.com (8.8.7/8.8.8) with SMTP id WAA03274; Sun, 28 Dec 1997 22:01:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from domo by lists.xmission.com with local (Exim 1.73 #4) id 0xmYDy-0001z0-00; Sun, 28 Dec 1997 22:58:50 -0700 Message-Id: <199712290558.VAA01669@mail.san.rr.com> From: "Jay Hill" To: Subject: Re: (fractint) Fractal encryption Date: Sun, 28 Dec 1997 21:57:42 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-fractint@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: fractint@lists.xmission.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-UIDL: d81093fdb43793391a3228eca921def6 Hi Martin, ---------- > From: Martin Hecko > I don't know if this topic has been discussed on this list before, but > here is my question. > Could it be possible to use fractals as a way to encrypt information? > How strong the encryption would be? It has not appeared here, but has been discussed on sci.crypt. Usually getting a general brush off. > I have thought of very simple method. For simplicity's sake lets use the > regular mandelbrot formula. The password (or the passphrase) would be > the initial parameters for an iteration. > Then take the first part of plain text, make first iteration of the > formula, run the result through some convenient hash algorithm and xor > the result with the plain text. Repeat the above steps for the rest of > the plaintext. I have thought about this at length. Here are some specific ideas. You are suggesting a stream cipher using the MSet as a pseudo-random number generator. The key you use is, as you say, the coordinates, c, in the equation z[n+1]=z[n]*z[n]+c, z[0]=0. > I don't know if it would work (due to the fact that the floating point > calculations would have to be converted to integers and this could cause > inaccuracies in results). Floating point must be done with plenty of precision, double (64 bit) is a minimum. The main weakness is that the values z[n] are not uniformly distributed. Although this may be offset by a hash function, it can limit the search space of the attacker. Even worse, key values not carefully chosen lead quickly to divergence to infinity or to a periodic attractor. Only chaotic c are acceptable. While marginally chaotic c are known on the boundaries of the components, the only really chaotic values can be found accurately on the real line. This greatly limits your key space - to one dimension. A possibility of a two dimensional key space might be to include the initial z[0] as part of the key rather than using z[0]=0. Care must be taken that c is in fact not in a bud or cardioid (a component). For every point that is truly chaotic, a periodic point (in a component) is only an infinitesimal distance away. If c is in a component, then the z[n] sequence is doomed to periodicity. The Lyapunov exponent is a measure the chaos. But it can only be estimated by following the sequence to great lengths. The Lyapunov exponent will indicate chaotic behavior right up to the point where the first period is reached. It will then drop in one iteration into non-chaos values - a disaster if it occurs in your message! Since, at that point your sequence may start repeating. A large Lyapunov exponent indicates chaos, which is desirable in the sequence. However, it also indicates divergence when a very small perturbation (one bit) occurs incorrectly in the arithmetic. Therefore, the message sender and receiver must use exactly identical arithmetic processing. This can be a problem across platforms. > I realize that this is not exactly a topic about Fractint itself, but I > think there are many knowledgable people on this list that have > potential to contribute to this discourse. > Martin Jay PS Taking an off topic penalty..... brain { ; A brain after too much crypto thinking ; by Jay Hill, 1997 reset=1960 type=phoenixcplx center-mag=1.1175e-005/-8.65e-007/0.6666663 params=0.27/0.02/0.25/0.1/0 float=y maxiter=256 outside=atan colors=000<62>wwwwwwvvv<61>KKKKKKKKL<76>bbvccwccv<43>112000000000 } - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint"